Browns - Deshaun Watson - Football Talk | Page 25 | Barking Hard

Browns Deshaun Watson - Football Talk

madmadworld said:
I think there have been very few Elite QB's ever. 10-12
HOF is easier to justify you just have to be top 5-10 for years or win a few SB rings.

The Aussie rules Football has a HOF but what's cooler harder is becoming a Legend voted on after the persons in the HOF.
not one every year. started in 1996.
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32 Legends since 1996. And they stole the idea from the NRL, which has an even more exclusive distinction.

The NRL has the “Immortals,” of which there are only 13 in the history of the sport - with the concept launched in 1981.

Some of the greatest players to have stepped foot on the field have not made the cut. Even my guy Johnathan Thurston is not a guaranteed Immortal - despite two premierships, 4x Dally M (only ever), 3x golden boot (only ever) among a litany of club and NRL and global awards and statistical accolades.

And I honestly find that a little frustrating.

I suppose it depends on your definition when it comes to elite. I would simply consider elite to be anyone who is top five at their position at any time. In that respect, I would consider Watson to be elite.

A definition so exclusive that only a couple of players make the cut, in my opinion, isn’t broad enough for the ebbs and flows of football.
 
BDU said:
32 Legends since 1996. And they stole the idea from the NRL, which has an even more exclusive distinction.

The NRL has the “Immortals,” of which there are only 13 in the history of the sport - with the concept launched in 1981.

Some of the greatest players to have stepped foot on the field have not made the cut. Even my guy Johnathan Thurston is not a guaranteed Immortal - despite two premierships, 4x Dally M (only ever), 3x golden boot (only ever) among a litany of club and NRL and global awards and statistical accolades.

And I honestly find that a little frustrating.
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Thanks for all that insight.
BDU said:
I suppose it depends on your definition when it comes to elite. I would simply consider elite to be anyone who is top five at their position at any time. In that respect, I would consider Watson to be elite.
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That's soo wide there would be hundreds of them over the past. by that @ QB there would be guys that are not HOF being Elite.

Only going thru the 1970s. all below were top 5 for a year.
Bill Nelsen
John Hadl
Roman Gabriel
Jim Hart
John Brodie
Craig Morton
Charley Johnson
Bert Jones
Joe Ferguson
Jim Zorn
Brian Sipe
Dan Fouts
Steve DeBerg

Only Dan Fouts is a HOF'er. I don't know if I would vote for any of them and 2 are Browns QB's.
most here too young to recall them ?
BDU said:
A definition so exclusive that only a couple of players make the cut, in my opinion, isn’t broad enough for the ebbs and flows of football.
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well
 
Watson looked much, much better in game 2. Not all the way back, but showed flashes of greatness again (like the throw above).

Unfortunately for him he was running for his life all day because Reader dominated Frohodlt and Wilks and Conklin suck and were turnstiles. We had no running game thanks to the domination of the Cincy DL.

I just can’t get over how bad our OL has become. I can’t get over how bad we are at DT. The LOS are so important and we are failing at both.

To be fair, it was impossible to predict the 3 centers going down and Conklin being completely done. Wills was bad last year; he’s bad again. That experiment has to end at LT.

Berry has completely neglected DT. We just watched Reader on Cincy show you how important DT’s are. It’s no coincidence that Hubbard & Hendrickson are having such good seasons. Having the ability to collapse the pocket from the middle destroys an offense completely. I watched for years at Clemson. Reader, Dexter Lawrence, Christian Wilkins all dominated the middle at Clemson…and we all know how their DL’s were praised and gushed over from 2015-2019.

It also bleeds into the secondary when they don’t have to cover for 5-10 seconds.

Anyway, big issues to fix on both LOS. And for a group of men that consider themselves so smart, neglecting the LOS is about one of the dumbest things you can do in football.
 
Watson is washed up! The OP talked about Baker Mayfield handcuffing this team. Wrong! That be Stefanski! The team has looked exactly the same with Watson as it did with Baker and Brissett! Berry has also handcuffed the future of the organization. Unbelievable. I’m sure there are deeper reasons on why these clowns are still employed.
 
johnnycomelately said:
Watson is washed up! The OP talked about Baker Mayfield handcuffing this team. Wrong! That be Stefanski! The team has looked exactly the same with Watson as it did with Baker and Brissett! Berry has also handcuffed the future of the organization. Unbelievable. I’m sure there are deeper reasons on why these clowns are still employed.
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Wokeism/Analytics
 
She is right though....there isn't a reason to get rid of Stefanski. Priefer, Woods....absolutely. Stefanski? No.

The reality is that Stefanski isn't on the hot seat. The media and fans are just looking for somebody to blame and he is the easiest target.
 
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TheBestPlayersPlay said:
I disagree. Stats misrepresent the coach he is. He wants to be OC ...fine. He is a terrible head coach.
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I don't think he's a great coach, at least not yet, but he's better than we've had for a good while. Kitchens instead of Williams really hurt. But Jimmy can't fire him, no way. The league respects Stefanski, and if we fired him, it'd be tough to get another rising star. 3rd season as a head coach, made the playoffs and got a win, even if he wasn't there (covid). Last season was major disappointment but hard to judge his offense because of Baker's fucked up shoulder. This season's offense has been just barely ok and worse lately. This is a major test for Stefanski and Watson. If we can't run the ball, which we've kinda been sucking at, it's going to be a long day for Watson, or he's going to be our savior because he's a bad mofo. We will see.
 
Martin Eden said:
I don't think he's a great coach, at least not yet, but he's better than we've had for a good while. Kitchens instead of Williams really hurt. But Jimmy can't fire him, no way. The league respects Stefanski, and if we fired him, it'd be tough to get another rising star. 3rd season as a head coach, made the playoffs and got a win, even if he wasn't there (covid). Last season was major disappointment but hard to judge his offense because of Baker's fucked up shoulder. This season's offense has been just barely ok and worse lately. This is a major test for Stefanski and Watson. If we can't run the ball, which we've kinda been sucking at, it's going to be a long day for Watson, or he's going to be our savior because he's a bad mofo. We will see.
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I don't want a rising star... I want a coach whose no nonsense.. Makes adjustments and whose not afraid to bench people for lack of production...
 
nickers said:
I don't want a rising star... I want a coach whose no nonsense.. Makes adjustments and whose not afraid to bench people for lack of production...
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I'm not thrilled with him so far, but I'm tired of changing coaches every year. I think they'll give him two more years to mature as a head coach. I hope he does. It's not an easy job. But he certainly has a long way to go. But for sure, now that he has a top 5 NFL franchise QB, he has to produce a division title and a deep playoff run next season. I'll give him the rest of this season to get acquainted with how to best utilize DW. But today is still a big day for DW and KS. They need a good one. Last year, I started the season with huge expectations, we all did. Then Baker tried to make the tackle and all was lost. This year I never really believed we'd make the playoffs. Funny how I thought it would be because of Brissett and it ended up being, for the most part, our lack of toughness on defense. We must cure that first for next season to work. But a lot of fans like me need to see something that makes us hopeful that our offense will be top 5 next season. It should be. No excuses.
 
^Exactly.

If I didn't perform at my workplace, I was told about it by my supervisor's and was subsequently passed over for certain operations. Even if they were guys I hung around with, drank with and had been to their house for dinner and knew and loved their families.

In the case of KS he should've sat Woods down and made it clear that shit is unacceptable in any world and certainly not here. Same for Priefer. You will change or you can go work somewhere else. If KS doesn't have it in him he's not HC material. If KS is restrained by the FO or ownership from having those conversations, then this franchise truly is fucked.

DW$ came here for the money.
I left that dollar sign in there as it was an honest typo on my part! I hit the number 4 with the caps on.

Season 7 Oops GIF by Workaholics
 
It's not every year, and nobody wants to fire anyone the minute something goes wrong. It's been 3 years. You don't continue to employ someone who is underperforming year after year on a hope and a dream. Stefanski inherited a talented roster, minus the QB ...and only succeeded in perpetuating drama and making them worse. He took a Superbowl window that was wide open, and slammed it shut.
 
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